Twinsonian's Forum Posts

    There's only so much of posts saying things like "go use a different product" or "they're dumb lol" that I'm willing to take on the forum, and I also feel this thread has run its course. It's already going in circles with the same points being made. With Construct 3 we made some bold changes and yes, those changes may not be for everybody, but we are going to stick with the plan for the time being. That's not to say we'll stick with it forever, there's always scope to make changes in future, but we want to at least see how things work out with our current plans.

    Different product discussion is healthy. Competition gives incentive to make a product (rental) better. I have already moved on to other alternatives for my game making hobbies. They cost much less, and are more feature rich. They do not include the event system -- but really the event system is just a GUI glorified scripting language. Technically it could easily be converted to a basic typed out scripting language and function the same. This isn't saying that it sucks, it certainly does not, but once users realize that languages like python or lua really are not a huge step forward in complexity with frameworks, it is not a big deal.

    The construct brand is heavily regarded as a hobby tool because it lacks strongly perceived features that are vital. Whether these perceptions are correct or incorrect doesn't matter, in the end Scirra's income model will or will not verify this. People bringing up other tools is to help bring the spotlight on what construct needs to mature. This is literally what big companies pay for -- real solid feedback on what their product needs to sell more. Lashing out against these feature requests and ideas, is directly lowing your product's perception and potential income. Real and reliable exporters (native) are a great example of this. From the tone of your post, it is clear this frustrates you, but is it the fact that people are bringing up other products, or the fact that yours is lacking necessary functionality for their needs?

    We are thinking about a way to allow previously subscribed users to more easily use Construct 3, so they don't have to pay a whole year subscription for some light maintenance. We don't want to make any firm announcements right now so we can keep our options open, but I am keen to provide something on this front. I must also emphasise that even with an expired subscription, you can still access your project and all its artwork, sounds, music and so on, so you can extract that and use it elsewhere if you want to.

    You can no longer edit the project. Yes you can extract your resources to use on a different engine or framework. I fail to understand why you are not acknowledging that this is a lockout on the project. What if I am a huge lego hobbyist -- I rent an apartment, and start building a replica of my city. One day I forget to pay rent and am literally locked out of the apartment. Yes, I can still see in through the windows, but I can no longer interact with my creation -- without continuing to pay rent, forever. I am now locked out of continuing my work in this apartment. I would need to get a different apartment, or pay the rent (extortion fee)

    I'd also add that as a subscription, I think Construct 3 is still great value. You can use it for years and years accessing all features and all exporters before it gets close to the price of the all-exporters price for other tools. It's also cheaper than the subscription for PhoneGap Build alone. So not only are we going to provide a build service similar to PhoneGap Build, but it's also cheaper, and comes with an entire game development IDE as well. The pricing isn't just for one feature, it covers everything, but I think that perspective does show - it's still not a particularly expensive product.

    Other products offer a choice on exporters. Yes, they are expensive, unless you explore open source tools, frameworks, and engines. What we users have to go by is actual and factual history. We have paid a one time fee to purchase the product and knew what we were getting. Now you are asking that we just trust you, because you are going to bring all kinds of great new features. And this requires that we are locked in for an entire year subscription. After six months, if -- for example you do not deliver.. then what? I guess we have six months longer to use a product that did not deliver, but we dont have to re-subscribe right? This subscription thing is gross and is an awful business model. It is great for companies, and disgusting for the consumers. Renting software sucks, and the poll shows it.

    Remember that if you're keen to see major new features like 3D, timelines, modularity or collaboration, we're very much limited by our resources, and it's difficult to make the jump to hiring new developers if we have a less stable income.

    3D? I mean really? After how many years of the same rock hard cement answers about 3D, now we are exploring this option. Modularity and collaboration -- if you want these features you will succumb to our demands and use our subscription model. Again, once subscribed -- they will come, whenever we are ready. So please -- essentially, PRE-ORDER our product -- we will deliver - we promise.

    It seems to me a more stable income would be expanding your customer base -- not extorting the current base for rent. I would personally love to pay an additonal 25-50 dollars for an official scirra 3D addon to Construct 2 as an example. Then again, there are plenty of people who dont care about 3D and would not be required to purchase it. This would be a great model -- official addons for things like: 3D, timelines, modularity, and collaboration. Being locked out of a product that you do not own is filthy -- while I understand your reasoning for it, I personally do not agree with it -- and I am not alone.

    Finally I'm sure some people are going to point at this thread and accuse us for shutting out discussion of the topic. I'd like to point out that this thread has been open since February 1 - over three months - and has nearly two hundred replies, including several from myself. After this time of allowing all this discussion I believe there is little else to be gained from allowing this thread to continue. I have read nearly every post in this thread, and as many as I can from the Construct 3 forum, and often posts from other forums and websites. We have heard everyone's points, in some cases I've directly responded to them, and now it has simply come down to re-hashing the same things. Even if it doesn't make sense to anyone else, we have a clear plan and a vision for where we want to go. I'm confident in time our decisions will become clearer, much as the choice of HTML5 over Flash originally mystified many but ended up being the right way to go. I'd like to thank everyone for their energy and feedback, and please be assured we'll still be listening and posting here on the forum, as we continue to develop Construct 3 in future.

    You started your post with the almighty I am tired of hearing something I dont like -- dont force my hand speech. Again, I appreciate you have a clear plan on the direction you want to go. Shutting down everyone else' conversation about the issue seems childish. If you do not like the discussion that people are having, why have a forums? Is it supposed to be all rainbows and sunshine with Scirra worship? When a significant portion of your community disagrees with you, they will find a way to have a conversation about it.

    I find this new direction that Scirra is going in to be very disappointing. I came back to check in to see what was going on -- read through the previous discussions, and am saddened by the result. On a personal level -- the Scirra team are great people, and I wish them the best in their future endeavors. Unfortunately, I will not be a part of those.

  • I picked GM up during a steam sale awhile back for super cheap. The software was buggy, crash prone, and heavily bogged down by DRM. Users that have invested a lot in to that engine are right to be worried. Playtech is not the type of company that cares about community and game development other than for pure profit. The company also has questionable practices with malware. If I was a GM user I would be worried about the future of the product.

  • I recently picked up a 2in1 laptop and love it. I am finding that I am in tablet mode a lot. c2 has been pretty fun to use in touch mode though it is slower to use. Specifically it would be nice to be able to scroll up and down when setting properties like gravity. Anyone else messing with c2 with touch?

  • anpur fantastic! That would be sooooo amazing.

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  • Great post Ashley has made it pretty clear that scripting will not be available. Hopefully with the new editor plugin system the community could add that type of functionality? Love the entire post though -- for construct to shine it needs to continue growing.

  • codah I get what you are saying and I like what you are on to. I agree -- and I can even say I do not even have a need to actually code the events. Something along the lines of what you are talking about sounds great too! I think we can agree that having to click 4 dialog windows deep to do one simple thing gets old.

    Although the one thing that your post doesn't address is still the reusing of evens and event blocks. Or that nasty little pop up that tells you that you certain events cannot be pasted because of blah.

    Even though I am a coder I can easily admit that the event system is fantastic -- but the event system needs SOME way or improvements to more rapid development and re-usability. I genuinely think this is something that can be accomplished without having to code as you point out. I am open to anything.

  • Being able to actually just type out the events is all I could dream of. Clicking on GUIs is tedious, especially when dealing with a lot of events such as manipulating and checking through 2d arrays. Being able to simply type what is already there and having the ability to copy paste and reuse the code (events) in a less awkward way would be amazing.

    I don't need other language support (lua, python, etc) -- and I don't even need access to the javascript. Just the exact wording of the events in its own script. (could call it CScript, or EScript or whatever) as an alternative to:

    click add event > click Sprite > Click is on-screen. as oppsed to simply typing: Sprite1 Is on-screen.

    Maybe that isn't the best example, but the point is it would be nice to be able to have freedom with the current event system.

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  • I was/am proud to have contributed financially to the development of C2. Even though I feel the direction from C1 to C2 wasn't what I personally was hoping for, the overall product is a success and speaks volumes of Scirra.

    *HOWEVER*

    To be able to justify spending again on a new license for a new product I would have to see some things done differently. These are OPINIONS, and are not designated as ATTACKS on Ashley, Scirra, C2, or anyone else. These are my personal thoughts and these things impact my decision on moving forward with C3.

    1) Built in language support of some kind. The Event system is a slow and tedious experience as the game gets more and more complex.

    2) Exporting options really need to be addressed. This is the number one turn off for many that otherwise found C2 appealing. While the website boasts a wide range of export options -- really there only needs to be the main exporting options: Desktop(win max linux), HTML5, android, and iOS. Other technologies can be addressed later.. and honestly even linux or mac is not a huge thing (even though I would much prefer having a linux export) as long as these export options are reliable.

    3) More expandable. Not sure how to summarize this one. Community development of addons and plugins but to a much greater extent. Being able to add true 3D support via a community developed addon sounds wonderful. Or a community created sprite editor? Community supported language addons/wrappers for C3? A Modular C3 would be amazing and lessen the burden on the small team -- while giving the community an opportunity to expand and customize C3 as needed.

    I want to continue supporting Scirra, but if the product remains the same and is unable to really grow up in to a full pledged game creation studio, there are just far better options. Nothing personal -- I truly adore the Scirra guys, but money can be tight and there are a lot of options out there, including free.

  • This is a very tough subject to answer correctly. That site does a terrible job on answering which is the best 2D engine because "best 2D engine" has a ton of different angles to evaluate.

    In terms of speed and performance, LibGDX is ridiculously fast. Have a read on this post:

    http://www.badlogicgames.com/forum/view ... 11&t=13805

    There are other examples to be found with benchmarks that show it is absolutely wonderful.

    On the other hand, managing memory with libgdx can be tedious and sometimes frustrating, and the fact that the engine uses 0,0 xy coordinates at the bottom left instead of the top left can really cause a lot of confusion! Especially when dealing with custom cameras etc.

    Construct 2 has a lot of the boring already pre-made, but is also extremely powerful. The event system while an acquired taste -- really is very powerful. I have some event sheets in my game that span longer than certain classes I have done with libgdx for my games. The developers for C2 really are special. Ashley is a very unique and talented individual with a bright bright future. I have a ton of faith with Scirra.

    Clickteam fusion? I mean really? It is so outdated and not even in the same league anymore. I do not know why that is even on the list.

    LOVE is awesome in it's own right. Really a solid engine.

    Gamemaker... this horse has been beaten to death on the forums.

    I personally enjoyed using Monogame, except for the content pipeline. It was awkward. Also GODOT is really really cool, and complicated.

    Game Develop recently went open source, so we will see where that leads. I am glad that I have supported Scirra and absolutely love working with C2.

  • Must... resist.. trolling IE.

  • If I am understanding this correctly, wouldn't this be solved by creating another sprite with the same image(s) and giving it the same behaviors and variables and putting it on a different layer?

    Are you asking for a way to have multiple sprites of the same type on multiple layers?

  • I say Meh ...

    Had a look at it , More like CC , even so , I would personally prefer CC ,

    But I would strongly advise you to ...

    Learn a Programming Language & Join the Dark side !

    I have, but for being able to prototype it is nice to use these types of tools.

    looks like a step in a hard direction events definitely are messy and will be making it harder to vebug and/or find relevant pieces later in your code,

    I agree but I am still impressed with it. I will still use C2 when on my windows machine... it would make no sense to stop using software I paid for.

    It's not necessarily that bad, its free for one thing which is always a nice touch. The main issue I see with this software is that it lacks a community, which in my opinion seems really important. Also will the developer update it often? Construct 2 has consistent updates and will probably be the only 2d engine I plan to use for now, until I move onto a 3d engine.

    This I agree with.

    There are a multitude of tools out there. Some great some not, I think having more tools in the toolbox is more advantageous than limiting myself. On the other hand I am pleased to find tools like Game Develop or even game-editor for that matter that allow for more freedom.

    Great points everyone, and there is one thing for certain. This is the best community.