Should I use C2 for a large game?

Hi,

I've built a prototype (in C2, no less!), got an artist, getting my pre-production stuff out of the way. I'm going to build a game with multiple levels, lots of mechanics and player tools, dialogue, all of that fun stuff. C2 is really easy to use, and I have experience in it, and I have a license; all of these things incline me towards using it. Plus, every new builds brings with it exciting and awesome new features.

However, there's no debugger, some things are harder to do than if you had access to the code (bulk-updating lots of events to point to a different object, for example), and I'm sure you've run into issues in your own games. It's possible that these are no longer issues with upcoming builds, or that these have already been fixed, of course!

It has ups and downs, everything does, but I'm wondering if it's powerful enough for a large game that I'd actually be able to sell. It's a really new piece of technology, which is another thing that gives me pause. We're all C2 fans and devs here, so the temptation to evangelize this engine is probably pretty high, but I'd really appreciate an honest opinion. I would hate to go full steam ahead with C2 and find that this was the wrong choice. (Plus, I'm already a licensed member!)

In short, are you or would you make a large-scale game in this engine? Why or why not?

Thanks for your replies!

-Chris

Never better than a real Native programming languages, if you really have the know how, BUT at least equal, or a little, little bit less.

The main issue while programming in AS3, what would be the best choice for you (by the easy of use with Flash, and easy of porting for XBOX 360 and PlayStation) or in C#, is the portability loss, and that's The Point.

HTML5 and java would domain the world someday!

Also, you get the easy of Use, easy of Plugin implementation, fast prototyping, and a lot of stuff already done and largely tested and mature.

Plus, Ashley will implement a lot of stuff to make easy the team work, modularity, etc.

Don't think two times and buy your C2 to support They to make the best tool for game developers, being Curious and Hobbyists to Serious Developers.

I'm currently working on a medium scale game, and also have begun a large scale game in c2, so yeah. :)

The most important thing to do in my opinion on a large project in c2 is learn to organize code well so what you're looking for is easy to find, and easy to read when you find it, because otherwise a tangled uncommented mess of events can be quite difficult to work with when there are enough of them.

Also make sure to run tests early to make sure your target platform can handle what your completed game will be doing (ram, CPU use, rendering, etc).

Arima, if I may ask, why are you building your large game in C2?

Because C2 is almost exactly the game design tool I've been wanting someone to create for ages. I've tried tons of others, and I know it's partially a subjective thing, but c2 has a great workflow, it's easy to understand the event system (which is very helpful when trying to wrap my head against complex chunks of code), and no other tool I've found comes close having to the ease of use, power and flexibility that c2 does. You can make basically any 2d game with c2.

On top of that, c2 does an utter ton of stuff for you that otherwise you'd have to code on your own. I've heard it again and again when people ask what tool to use to make their game: "do you want to make games, or engines?" People who use raw code often end up working for ages on the underlying engine and tools before they can even get to starting work on the game itself. Many people don't get past the first step at all because they realize that the engine they've written is clumsy and they go back to fix it, or by the time they're done the industry has advanced and what they're doing is obsolete - getting stuck working on the engine and not the game.

C2 offers ease of use, power, flexibility and is actively developed so bugs are fixed often. Large game, small game - the only difference I've found is how long it's going to take to preview once all of the assets are in the game, which is probably the same no matter what tool you use (a professional game developer I know laughed when I complained about 5 min preview times with loot pursuit in construct classic (c2 is much faster at previewing, btw). I can't remember how many hours he said it took, but it was many. Of course, he was compiling way, way more data than I was).

I totally second Arima. I was going to make a big text here but I feel the same way.

To be fair, native programming is probably better than C2, but there are many many maaaaany things already done for you here, specially because we're talking about HTML5 and all it's features here. And you know the internet is powerful.

I'm doing a medium scale and large scale game using C2 too. Arima raises a lot of great points. C2 doesn't limit you, you have the ability to ask and make plugins if there currently isn't a feature, so it's just as good as anything if you want to make a 2D game, be it a massive game or not. Even so, don't limit yourself with the tool you use, even if C2 WAS low on features, you could still get epic results depending on how much effort you put in and knowledge you have in the logic of games.

"Do you want to make games, or engines?" People who use raw code often end up working for ages on the underlying engine and tools before they can even get to starting work on the game itself. Many people don't get past the first step at all because they realize that the engine they've written is clumsy and they go back to fix it, or by the time they're done the industry has advanced and what they're doing is obsolete - getting stuck working on the engine and not the game.

Bravo! This is an absolute gem of a point and I can't possibly put it any better. If you want to make a GAME, you'll find no better engine than C2.

some things are harder to do than if you had access to the code (bulk-updating lots of events to point to a different object, for example)

Doesn't the new 'Replace object' feature do just this?

We've designed C2 to be able to still handle large projects as elegantly as possible (e.g. event sheet includes for code re-use, texture memory management in the WebGL renderer, etc). However I'm not currently aware of anything really huge already published with C2. I'm not sure why that is - possibly a lot of people focus on mobile where CPU/RAM is really limited, and the node-webkit exporter's relatively new so perhaps not many projects are focusing on it yet. So in a way it's still kind of untested waters. There may be a few hiccups, but we 100% want to support large projects robustly, so if anything goes wrong let us know and we'll try to fix it.

Would you consider Super Ubi Land a large scale game?

Tekniko Yeah, I'd say that's a medium-large scale game (Although now it goes by Super Yubi Land after legal issues with Ubisoft)

I definitely know of a few others in the works - Loot Pursuit being of them.

It's going to depend on the type of large game. I think it would be better to implement an RPG in Unity or a graphic adventure in Wintermute, or a text game in Inform, but for platformers, shooters, and puzzle games of virtually any size, I'd go for C2 first.

I'm 11 months into my game, and C2 is fantastic to use, heaps more enjoyable and efficient to work with than CC and MMF2. The biggest problem for me is still wrappers/export functionality and fullscreen performance on some computers (I'm hoping Ashley will do that feature that can render smaller and scale up). The Mac node-webkit is hardly working for my game, so I'm basically Windows only at the moment.

I'm doing a pretty big 2D iOS Run & Shoot game. Sounds simple, but the systems I've got in place will show you what I mean. Haha! My biggest game idea is somewhat an RPG mixed with multiplayer co-op. I'll wait on Construct 2 to have more user friendliness in maintaining huge databases. Right now, as a guy who has hopped on mainly because of the "no programming required" factor of C2, I just find maintaining my hash tables and arrays, too damn hard.

On top of that, c2 does an utter ton of stuff for you that otherwise you'd have to code on your own. I've heard it again and again when people ask what tool to use to make their game: "do you want to make games, or engines?" People who use raw code often end up working for ages on the underlying engine and tools before they can even get to starting work on the game itself. Many people don't get past the first step at all because they realize that the engine they've written is clumsy and they go back to fix it, or by the time they're done the industry has advanced and what they're doing is obsolete - getting stuck working on the engine and not the game.

This, this, this this this. This is me for the last decade when it comes to programming anything. I decided to take a 2 year hiatus from coding. I only came back because of C2.

Since using this. I have a handful of prototypes. One finished game which needs WebGL on CJS before it will run well enough. This game is all about massive number of objects :D so i need the webgl performance :P

I'm also working on an Ouya game that is hitting the 80% mark. it's great. C2 is great. I love C2 :) even when I have complaints. I complain because I love :D

I have a 2D Online fighting game in the planning. It's going to be big. I also have some RPG ideas.