I don't have this bug. But I made an Electron-Version:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5FlDY ... sp=sharing

You have to double click for fullsreen.

Yep already saw the test results in our discord channel for electron exporting.

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I've created a bug report on their git, I'd appreciate some feedback and maybe an upvote, which usually helps to get the attention of a NWjs team member.

Ashley feel free to comment on the report and correct any mistakes, keep in mind that I'm not an expert so some parts of the report might be inaccurate.

(Of course all C2 members and/or people with knowledge about the web can take part in the report as well.)

Um, so instead of making events to change a few variables, you want to change a feature to allow you to choose what variables not to change?

I think he just wants a way to reduce the repetitive work that's involved in setting multiple variable values at once.

I guess C3 could bring changes to this by using special "filters" where you can select your variables.

So basically instead of a drop-down menu with the option of only selecting one variable, a listview with all variables were you can select multiple ones could be the solution to this and make things a lot easier.

... One person says he has this issue on Windows 7 Ultimate. So it turns out it's not OS dependent.

I've got an idea about the NWjs issues and how we could determine if it's really NWjs/C2 or crappy drivers that are at fault here.

Since Armaldio got that Electron exporting to work, how about him or someone else that already tested out the "new" exporting method, export your example from this bug report using Electron and then test out if the issues are still occurring. I think that way we be at least 90% sure that it's NWjs's or C2's fault and not the fault of drivers that almost always get blamed on first.

I've posted this here because I felt like people that are not in our Discord should also know about our progress in finding a fix for these issues.

Please provide your OS information, I would like to make sure that this is not a bug caused by buggy drivers and/or Win10.

We have to somehow identify the cause of this bug and then hope that Ashley or the NWjs team will fix it.

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The bug is not occuring on my end, I'm using:

OS: Win7 (64bit)

NWjs: v0.18.5 & v0.18.6

...The key point is as a small company, we don't have the resources to maintain all those libraries ourselves ...

Alright thanks for sharing your view on native engines and their possible risks (again). I think the sentence on top pretty much sums it up. Don't get me wrong I understood that going native also means dealing with buggy 3rd parties, drivers etc. but you could find problems like that on both ends.

I guess in the end it all comes down to the things we've experienced, I personally didn't experience that many issues while developing software with a native base. I guess you've got some pretty bad experiences with C1, that make you think the way you think about native engines right now.

All that's left for me to say is, if you decide to go on with a web based engine please maintain the base plugins.

Currently you're investing all of your time into C3's development and I get that's why you might not be able to deliver the support we expect to get.

However once C3 is out I'm hoping that you're going to get back to those broken/unfinished plugins and provide the support that the users of those plugins need.

I don't feel the need to give you examples on this regard but you should know best which ones currently really need some attention.

Just jumping in to say that, at least back in the nwjs 13.0 days, you could get nwjs builds to run on XP by dropping dbghelp.dll from the official nwjs package into the build folder. Don't know if that'll still work, I don't have a machine with XP installed around to test, but worth a try?

Even though I have done some "hacky" workarounds in the past with certain types of software, I don't really want to do that with NWjs.

You never know what else you could break by doing a workaround like that and if I would do that, I'd be the one held responsible for the bugs that might appear because of it.

Needless to say, it's good to know that it is possible to do that. However while issues with drivers will get fixed eventually, WinXP (in private use) will completely die out one day.

I'll get a 0.18.5 release out soon anyway.

Ashley could you please wait for their 0.18.6 release, it's just that they confirmed the single process fix for that version of NWjs recently.

Would save you the effort of creating another installer just for the fix.

> that "minify script" is a bad idea

>

How so?

Some of the older plugins/behaviors or ones made by beginners are not done correctly in order to be minified.

I'm not an expert but I think it just involves adding "[ ]" to some parts of the code. Basically the minifier cannot read through that kind of JS code and screws up.

Just some initial info's on start. Nothing new in the console while it flickers.

It's a really weird issue, did someone test it on Win7 already?

I see a lot of Win10 setups but no Win7 tests except mine.

Judging by the fact the 30 FPS cap feature only has ~30 stars despite the fact I always link to it, I think it's fair to say it's a niche feature. Everyone will always have their favourite feature they want which is difficult to do, regardless of the platform. For example users of native engines still want things like networking, including things like loading web-hosted images, which browsers do really well.

We didn't really spread the word about it, I bet that a lot of the people that read my post about it saw it for the first time.

Regardless it was just one out of many examples were the web is lacking features.

I'm sure someone will now say "but you could use libraries/frameworks to help", without realising the paradox that creates given others criticise us for depending on third-party code!

You cannot fully not rely on 3rd parties, I think we all hopefully got that by now but you've got to admit tough that despite the features that we won't get using a native base, we'd still have more options if we'd roll with native engines. More options also mean more workarounds or even better methods compared to those than the web currently offers.

Either way I get it, you want to keep on with the web and I can just hope that one day, I will be able to release my project without the fear that something could be messed up thanks to Google's latest chromium engine or NWjs.

> I could not reproduce, I though it had something to do with one of the NWjs processes but I somehow doubt it now.

>

> Either way, I've noticed that one of the three processes is slowly but steadily increasing in memory use.

> This might have an impact on low-end devices but I'm not sure, I will keep on trying to reproduce it on my end.

>

> EDIT: Do you guys use dual-screen setups or one single screen?

>

Dual-screen here, but the second machine I tested it on was purely on the laptop so one screen.

Alright another possible issue out of the way.

Are you able to open the dev-tools and look inside the console for me? (NWjs plugin action > Execute on start of layout)

I'm using a nightly build and it doesn't work for me for some odd reason, this could possibly mean that the new version has fixed this issue.

Please share the content of the console, error/warning or whatever messages it lists you there.

I could not reproduce, I though it had something to do with one of the NWjs processes but I somehow doubt it now.

Either way, I've noticed that one of the three processes is slowly but steadily increasing in memory use.

This might have an impact on low-end devices but I'm not sure, I will keep on trying to reproduce it on my end.

EDIT: Do you guys use dual-screen setups or one single screen?

>

> > That's why I suggest that - if you want issues fixed quickly, going direct is the fastest way.

> >

> I understand your point, but there are the cases where those companies wouldn't take our reports as serious as yours.

>

Good developers respect a good bug report regardless of where it comes from. The important thing is the report is clear and identifies a real problem.

Ashley with all respect I understand what you are trying to explain to us but this case against native engines, is not just about minor bugs and performance issues.

I like to go with examples, so I'd like to get back to this quite old report also known as the "30fps cap", some people will surely remember it. *

A fair amount of users have participated in it and have actively tried to convince the chromium team to add this feature but this is already more than 12 months old!

Do you personally see any progress being made, any real attempt of getting this implemented from their side?

It's things like these, things that are standard in native engines were the web is still lacking and I don't see a solution in waiting 1+ years until something has been done about it.

I know that going native will effectively make it impossible for 5-10% of the user base to execute and play our games but that is a risk I'm willing to take. And if you take into account that NWjs doesn't have WinXP support and Native does, things should be even again.

I'm not saying all of this because I hate you or your product, it's just so frustrating sometimes to wait months over months to get a fix or feature that natives already have for ages. I guess this is how things go with the web, I can't tell you more than the other C2 users around here already did.

It just feels like you actively try to avoid things like these and try to compensate the damage that these things already have done or still do to some serious devs around here. It's your business and you handle your business but seeing the latest progress of the competitors make C2 and possibly C3, look really old and something you don't want to work with. It might not be nice to read that but it is what it is and I cannot always keep on supporting something that is causing high amounts of frustration to it's user base.

* FPS cap reports: #1 and #2

I hope I could deliver the message well, if there is something that doesn't make sense or if someone would like to add something go ahead below.