+1 Great thanks again — Looking forward for the cranberrygame implementations examples.

None except IAP and AdMob.

There's a big tension around recently due to many recent bugs and old problems/topics as well. I am also frustrated as I'm trying to release my Android app which is finished, but both CocoonIO an IntelXDK have some unacceptable issues now.

Believe me I had moments I want to cry as well... but if you calm down and look at the big picture, then after all it's not C2 which is a problem. It is true that Ashley could have made better decisions sometime as megatronx mentioned, but well... that's another story.

Regarding that C2 is a "product which is supposed to do what it says on the box" I must disagree a bit. Software is not a bike. You can say that about an easy accountant software which needs just one update a year to adjust new tax rules, but not about an engine which is made to make other software. Thinking this ways you should have the version of C2 which you downloaded as first, and use only wrappers and everything around with the version which was available the time you downloaded that first C2. Then it would be what was on the box (at that time).

But we need/want more all the time right? This technology is extremely rapid. New things come out and we want them in C2, so we have updates and what goes after - issues which need some fix.

Let's be honest... even Microsoft and Googe make soft mistakes and they have a series of quality checks.

After all I have really mixed feelings, cause from one side I do understand the software production system and it flaws. But from another I am also tired of "hoping" that "they" will fix "it" soon.

I wouldn't judge anyone for dropping C2. I know sometimes frustration reaches the limit and you simply say "ahh f*** it!". Moving to Unity or something like that would probably give you better performance and feeling of stability, but surely development won't be that fun as with C2.

Personally I told a friend today that this is my second and last mobile game with C2. I'll be following IntelXDK and CocoonIO and wait for the good times (I'm sure they will come within maximum 2 years). But I'm absolutely not leaving C2. Let's face it. It is the best HTML5 game engine in the world.

P.S. Wanted to write some short thoughts just to follow this subject, but as usually I wrote ten times more than I planned (laughter through tears)

Is this how technology really evolves?

No, that's just how XDK evolves.... haha.

Made my day! Thank you!

I don't know what happend to Intel XDK within last week. I recompiled project today and with the same app I had 50% performance drop. After applying to all those suggestions mentioned above it helped a bit but not much. Still missing about 10-15FPS in comparison to last week.

Allright so I wanted to give it a try and wrap with CocoonIO but with Cordova IAP plugin and native C2 AdMob plugin. To see how many permission will stay there.

So I have removed (uninstalled) Coccon plugins and added custom plugins.

So as a result I have the following new entries in config.xml:

<cocoon:plugin name="https://github.com/cranberrygame/phonegap-plugin-ad-admob.git"/>
<cocoon:plugin name="https://github.com/cranberrygame/cordova-plugin-payment-iap.git"/>[/code:2mxcj5ht]

Tried to compile and recieved this error:

[code:2mxcj5ht]Fetching plugin "https://github.com/cranberrygame/phonegap-plugin-ad-admob.git" via git clone
Repository "https://github.com/cranberrygame/phonegap-plugin-ad-admob.git" checked out to git ref "master".
Installing "com.cranberrygame.phonegap.plugin.ad.admob" for android
Notice: com.google.playservicesssz@19.0.0 has been automatically converted to cordova-plugin-googleplayservices and fetched from npm. This is due to our old plugins registry shutting down.
Fetching plugin "cordova-plugin-googleplayservices@19.0.0" via npm
Failed to install 'com.cranberrygame.phonegap.plugin.ad.admob':CordovaError: Failed to fetch plugin cordova-plugin-googleplayservicesssz@19.0.0 via registry.
Probably this is either a connection problem, or plugin spec is incorrect.
Check your connection and plugin name/version/URL.
Error: version not found: cordova-plugin-googleplayservicesssz@19.0.0
at opt/sdks/cordova-6.0.0/node_modules/cordova-lib/src/plugman/fetch.js:146:33
at _rejected (opt/sdks/cordova-6.0.0/node_modules/q/q.js:797:24)
at opt/sdks/cordova-6.0.0/node_modules/q/q.js:823:30
at Promise.when (opt/sdks/cordova-6.0.0/node_modules/q/q.js:1035:31)
at Promise.promise.promiseDispatch (opt/sdks/cordova-6.0.0/node_modules/q/q.js:741:41)
at opt/sdks/cordova-6.0.0/node_modules/q/q.js:557:44
at flush (opt/sdks/cordova-6.0.0/node_modules/q/q.js:108:17)
at nextTickCallbackWith0Args (node.js:453:9)
at process._tickCallback (node.js:382:13)
Error: Failed to fetch plugin cordova-plugin-googleplayservicesssz@19.0.0 via registry.
Probably this is either a connection problem, or plugin spec is incorrect.
Check your connection and plugin name/version/URL.
Error: version not found: cordova-plugin-googleplayservices@19.0.0[/code:2mxcj5ht]

@AndreasR could you provide an example how to use Cranberrygame's plugins please?

Thanks a lot R0J0hound! Really good to know that.

With all other points I have to agree with you. As far as I know ludei works on it to exclude some permissions, but I guess the most will remain, sorry for that.

Let me know if you have any questions, I'll give my best to help you out!

I know they work on it and that some of them will remain. I read a bit on their forum to get familiar what is going on there. CocoonIO performs very well as I wrote before, but IMO permissions are the big issue there. I know from my experience that many people pay attention to the permissions they grant to apps. And giving permission for Location and Calls is highly suspicious. Even though Ludei explains why those are needed and we (developers) understand... there is still a point of view of the customer who has no idea "why" and he obviously doesn't care. It's suspicious - it's goodbye.

AndreasR thank you for all the clarifications. It's good to undestand as much as possible.

Huge thanks — I have your e-book, I used your tutorials and capx examples. Extremely helpful and made my "try" with CocoonIO ten times easier

— I haven't worked with AdMob yet, but I have my share with AdSense. So, IMO, AdMob use Location the determine what ad it will show to your user. Like, I'm from Sao Paulo, so if I'm playing a game with AdMob and some company bought some ads from it specifically to show on Sao Paulo users then I will see that particular ad.

I understand your thinking but IntelXDK does exactly the same and it does not require Location. AdMob (Google) has already enough information regarding where you are now and where are you from, from various sources. And it is totally enough. So requiring Location permission is unnecessary (as Intel proved).

Making apps/games in any engine requires programming. In C2 you're doing the programming by setting the events, so you are "building" the code instead of writing it.

For the database, it depends what you need. If you want to store user email in your database you will need some database server like MySQL. This is not a part of C2 any more, so you will have to probably write some PHP code to manage database.

All the rest can be done purely in C2.

Yes you can do all of that in C2. However to build a real time multiplayer game you will need to understand how WebRTC channels and signaling server work. This is one of the most difficult things and you can easily get frustrated by not understanding "why is this happening?!" etc. so I strongly encourage to first get familiar with C2 and then study the Multiplayer object. First of all when you start your multiplayer project you should read and really understand Multiplayer tutorial series wrote by Ashley: https://www.scirra.com/tutorials/892/mu ... 1-concepts